JAS's Rebuild and twincam conversion. 302kw atw baby!!!

[Komeuppance]

You ever degree your cams??

-Robert

[Lunacy]

even better a trip to wellington to atend one his 2 days tunning courses which i intend on doing , they r cheap. and he allows you access to the dyno to tune your car with his help ofcourse , i live in wellington and he is regarded as the best mitsituner in nz , and one of the best all round tunners .

the pwr your putting out isnt bad at all, but..
i agree with every coment made regarding the power and torque down low , and ya boost is coming on so slowly it must be so painfull looking at that boost guage.

if the engine was built well and solid which i believe it was then u have to look at the tune ,wantsom is right if ya going putting cams with longer duration its gona give u more lag and maybe a bit mopre power and torque but at a higher rpm

Yup il be going to the next one he does that im home for. Andre is certainly one of the best tuners in NZ and a gd dude as well, and has proved himself with plenty of vehicles he has tuned. Also his tunes are guaranteed as well - cant ask for much more than that!

[FST4RD]

I've heard so many stories about NZEFI... they just like to go for broke and tune it to the max HP it will possibly put out, rather then driveablitly. I know my mates turbo levin was like that, heard a few other stories like that to.
Although in saying that I haven't heard too many good stroies about many of the tuning places in Christchurch.

[OLD FART]

Have been racking my brains and wonder if it can be one or more of the following??
-ex gate leaking
- cam timing are you sure they are dialed in correctly
-Injectors maxed out
-something blocking the air flow. no bits of cloth in cooler . Check boost pressure before the cooler
to compare with cabin gauge to see how much drop in pressure
- faulty cas
- poor tuner
- compression test
-leakdown test
Jason I'm gasping at straws here as I know you have been using the best of everything in the build and hope you can get the result you seek without too much further hassle as it appears to me you have done everything right then the tuner is not up to it.

[kiwieurospec]

I know a couple to avoid, one first hand the hard way.
But RE Sinclair was real good, although not making more power the car was completely different to drive and well sorted.

[JAS]

Have been racking my brains and wonder if it can be one or more of the following??
-ex gate leaking
- cam timing are you sure they are dialed in correctly
-Injectors maxed out
-something blocking the air flow. no bits of cloth in cooler . Check boost pressure before the cooler
to compare with cabin gauge to see how much drop in pressure
- faulty cas
- poor tuner
- compression test
-leakdown test
Jason I'm gasping at straws here as I know you have been using the best of everything in the build and hope you can get the result you seek without too much further hassle as it appears to me that the tuner is not up to it.

Thanks Rad.

-The ex wastegate is brand new. So I hope not! But if it was it still wouldnt affect the ignition timing I wouldnt have thought.
-Im 99% sure Ive got the cam timing right.
-Ive got 750cc Injectors
-Ive got two boost gauges hooked up and am going to do some testing this weekend. I had thought of the old rag in the intercooler trick :)
-Doing a Compression test this weekend too.
-I hope its not a poor tuner. He has tuned heaps of evos with very good results.
-Ive thought of the CAS too. But unsure of how to test it.
-Im not sure what you mean by leckdown test. But the tuner tests the inlet track between the turbo and motor for lecks on every car before he puts it on the dyno.
Thanks RAD!! And everyone else :)
Will update Saturday night :)

[kushman]

u havent been sold a vr4 head with na cams in it witrh out knowing?

my thought is this, ya slow boost rise is and lag is giving u low power down low, then when psi finaly fires up ya get some good power , so is the turbo an issue? if not then i would be compression testing, leak down testing.. if they all come back good ya tune must be the seriously looked at , some tuners just cant be assed spending a good amount of time tunning.. and the more time they spend the better the tune.
my last car took six hours!

[OLD FART]

Jason re leakdown testing http://www.aa1car.com/library/leakdown.htm
btw what are the turbo specs??
The gate doesn't affect timing BUT if it is leaking it would be slow/laggy to come on boost

[perrinsohc]

I wish I could provide some input into this problem. I feel that I need to help out a fellow chch staz driver lol. Unfortunately I'm just too new at all of this My mate got his Libero tuned at Spec performance which I felt went really well. However, they all earthquake damaged atm. One of there cars is on the front cover of performance magazine atm too btw

[ProZac]

Heya Jas.

What was the static compression ratio of your motor? I had a feeling it was in the high 7's for some reason, which could be a contributing factor to the slow kick off...

Can you post up the details of your turbo, wheel sizes and trims, etc? brands?

The photos on FB make it look green! Looks bloody good though :)

[JAS]

Well. Interesting morning.

Did a compression test on it
#1 177psi
#2 180psi
#3 172psi
#4 176psi
Thats on a cold engine.
Then Daniel and I took it for a drive with a boost gauge plumbed in just after the turbo and one off the inlet manifold. Both gauges are new and the same brand.

With the boost set at 15psi, we got 15 psi at the inlet manifold and the gauge that was plumbed in just after the turbo had a heart attack!! Off the scale! Both gauges go to 20psi. Then I removed the boost control unit from the wastegate, so just going off the spring pressure. Got 16psi at the turbo and only 10psi at the inlet manifold. 6psi pressure drop!!! Far to much! Pulled the intercooler off thinking it could have oil or a rag in it. Nothing, nothing at all. No rag, not even a trace of oil.

So Im planing to remove the intercooler and make a piece of pipe to replace it. And then do the test again.

Not 100% sure on the specs of the turbo, Id have to have a look at it. But if it was to small it would boost up quick and have no top end and if it was to big it would boost up slow and give more top end. Im in the middle :(
Static compression is 8.4 I think. So should be fine.

Dont worry about it perrinsohc :)

Rad.
Thanks for the link on leakdown testing.

Robert
No never degree'd the cams in.

Here are some pics of the intercooler and the piping

[OLD FART]

Jason you have found the restriction so it appears the cooler for some reason is severely restricting flow.Thinking outside the square if there is no crap in the cooler is it possible that it has a radiator core instead of a bar & plate or tube & fin core???
Just remember to put the seat belt on real tight when you go for the test drive with the pipe in place of the cooler because I think you going to look like this :o :D
400 hp here we come :beer
PS would be going back to whoever made the cooler getting the tanks removed and watch to see why so much pressure drop from one side to the other.

[JAS]

Jason you have found the restriction so it appears the cooler for some reason is severely restricting flow.Thinking outside the square if there is no crap in the cooler is it possible that it has a radiator core instead of a bar & plate or tube & fin core???
Just remember to put the seat belt on real tight when you go for the test drive with the pipe in place of the cooler because I think you going to look like this :o :D
400 hp here we come :beer
PS would be going back to whoever made the cooler getting the tanks removed and watch to see why so much pressure drop from one side to the other.

Yes its a propper Bar and Plate cooler. I had it made around 10 years ago. Cost a fortune too! Maybe its just a fact of it being an old design or something.
Will be very interesting driving it without the cooler in place :D :D
If it does turn out to be the cooler Ill be taking it to where I got it made to see what they have to say about it.

[ProZac]

New intercoolers are pretty cheap now a days... A friend had his VQ30DET powered 180sx tuned at NZEFI the other day, they found a pretty big pressure drop across his intercooler also. They replaced it with one they sourced and it apparently cured heaps of issues.

For $300 you'd get a pretty top-spec cooler in about the same size, probably wouldnt have to modify much to fit it.

The pressure drop would make sense, as even though your manifold is seeing 15psi, your turbo is probably working outside of its efficiency range and just generally buggerising everything up...

Fuck man, I bet it still goes like a bloody rocket ship though :)

[perrinsohc]

All the best for the straight pipe, I'm pleased to here that you have another potential problem to fix. It's the worst when you can't figure out whats wrong. And better still you fixed the timing that may have been overlooked if you hadn't been investigating